Everyone please welcome my friend and fellow fit model Alia Parise to A Broadway Body: Continued Conversations! Alia and I have been seeing each other around the fit model world for a few years now. We often work together with the same clients, and I knew I needed to have a conversation with her.
Alia is a plus model who works with a wide range of clients. Because we both actively work as fit models, I wanted to discuss her experience as it pertains to her own body image. Her insight into what it takes to mentally protect yourself as a fit model is very similar to my own experience, and it was so lovely and healing to chat with someone who works in the same industry.
She references how fitting has helped her relate better to her own body and how, despite diet culture and the beauty industry’s loud opinions, she doesn’t want her body to change because she likes the size she’s at - something I can very deeply relate with as well. Alia is a wealth of knowledge in the fit world, and her views on body image inspired me. I left our conversation feeling as empowered as ever in my body, and I hope hearing Alia’s story empowers you too!
“ So it's understanding your measurements and how it relates to the public, so you almost become an advocate for other people of your size. And knowing how those comments affect you, that's where you can shut other people down, whether it's a tech, a designer or a friend, and you become a person who can speak for others, and that's really, really gratifying. “
- Alia Parise
Alia Parise: So I've always been a big girl. My dad was 6’3”, my mom was always 5’7”. So I've always been very tall on the thicker, curvier side. And, you know, growing up through high school and middle school, I was always the tall girl. I always stood at least four or five inches taller than my friends. But I was also always fuller-figured – I'm a 2X model. Most of my clients consider me 2X. And so, I would tend to wear baggy clothing, just things I was really comfortable in, you know, always kind of hiding my body, right? And I didn't get a lot of comments about people saying stuff to me because the thing about being the tall girl was nobody wanted to mess with me. So that was good. I didn't really get picked on a lot.
So going into college, I went to an art school. So again, it was really chill. Everybody there was very relaxed. Everybody's kind of focused on their art, so it wasn't really a lot of cliquey. It was kind of divided by majors. I was a graphic design major, and right out of college, I went into this lingerie company. And I know now that they were not very good. At the time, I just took it as a learning experience. So they said, “Oh, as a graphic designer, you're just gonna be back here behind the computer, making sure all the photos look good.” That lasted for all of one photoshoot.
So, from there, I started working the photoshoots. I worked hand in hand with the designers. At one point, I was helping them. She was “Ah, I need an idea for this.” I was even helping her. I was like, “Well, what if you try this for a design?” And she and I got very, very close, and we're still friends to this day, but they would also try stuff on me. And I still wasn't kind of comfortable in my body, but I was like, “Nobody's looking. We're all girls. I'm like whatever, I kind of don't care.” And then they brought in a new person to do marketing, and she saw that they were trying some stuff on me. She pulls me aside and goes, “You know you can get paid for that?” I said, “No, I didn't know that.” I didn't even know what a fit model was.
Megan Gill: Yeah.
Alia Parise: This was about seven years ago. And by that time, this job had just really deteriorated. The place was getting more and more toxic. And so, I was actually on an open casting for Torrid for a fit model, and they were my exact measurements, size 18. And it was actually during that casting that the designer and I were like, “We've had it. We quit!” I was coming home from the casting, I emailed this job and I just said, “I quit!”
Megan Gill: Mm-hmm. Good for you!
Alia Parise: Honestly, the best thing I could have done because this place was toxic. It was like too many cooks in the kitchen, and nobody wanted to take responsibility for anything. But I did chalk it as a learning experience because I did learn, you know, how things were supposed to fit, how photoshoots are actually run, coordinating this model with this agency and this photographer. So that was good.
From there, straight up quitting that job. I got the number of the agency that that girl had recommended the new marketing person, and I've been with that agency ever since. I went not necessarily full-time into fit modeling because, you know, as you start as a fit model, your work is slow. It was about a month or two before I got a really good client. I was there twice a week starting off, and from there I got thrown into the deep end of the fitting pool. I started off doing swimwear.
Megan Gill: I actually started off doing swimwear as well. So you're like, “Ope!” Yeah, you're right in it. Okay. Cool. Cool, cool.
Alia Parise: Exactly. I got thrown into the deep end. It's like I'm trying on skimpy underwear. And so, I got thrown into the deep end of the pool. I was having a conversation with somebody else one time. They're like, “I didn't realize just how much you're actually naked.” I was like, “Well, yeah, you're constantly changing clothes. You're not always naked in front of people, but yes, depending on what you're wearing.”
Megan Gill: Right, and I feel like that forces you to get a little bit more comfortable with your body, kind of right off the bat, or not even comfortable, but it forced me to be okay with being in bikinis in front of people, you know?
Alia Parise: Absolutely. I definitely agree with that. That first job where I got two days a week, it was knitwear, so it was like sweaters like this, shirts, skirts. And so, that got me a little more comfortable into actually talking about fit modeling, you know, fixing this, fixing that.
And then going into swimwear, like you said, I started to get more comfortable with my body much faster. And what I did realize, I got this from a couple of the techs, a couple of the designers, is they want you to be happy in the clothes. And so, it's like what can I do to change this? So you would be happy buying this? And that really changed my mindset. So they want the clothes to look good on you, and they want you to feel good in them, so you would be comfortable buying them at whatever price range they have at that point.
And so, I really got really comfortable with myself really fast. I've always been a big girl all my life. I've never been smaller than a 16 (except when I was 16). So I got comfortable being bigger chested, being curvier in my hip, and I've never really had a problem with that. But also what I've learned in fit modeling is you go into a fitting, and you're gonna hear a couple of phrases like, “This looks awful. “This doesn't look good.” And “Oh, this looks terrible. We need to fix it.” And if you're new to fit modeling and don't know anything about constructive criticism, that's gonna hurt.
Megan Gill: Yeah.
Alia Parise: So I will say having that little bit of design background from design school, teachers telling you your art sucks, fix, has given me a little bit of a thicker skin. So I will say, I feel like I had a little bit of a leg up there.
Megan Gill: Mm-hmm. I can relate with you on that too, coming from the theater world and the acting world where I'm so used to hearing no at this point, that when I get feedback or when I get that email like, “Oh, sorry, we went in a different direction.” I'm like, “Oh, wow, that's out of the norm.” So I can relate with you on that. I think it does help prepare you to not take things personally when comments are made, or when maybe you don't get the job even, or helping you understand that it's not about your body. It's not your body that “doesn't look good.” It's like we're here for like garments, right?
Alia Parise: Exactly, you develop a little bit of a thicker skin. Every now and again, you get some comment that was just like, okay, that was out of line. I think you mentioned here, not necessarily horror stories, but that first client, that swimmer client, they had a male tech there. It's not often that you see men who are techs, but every now and again, you get one. And we were talking about plans for the weekend. I said, “Oh, I'm going to the Sriracha factory.” Once a year. They had like a big open house. You get to see them process the chilies and they have different vendors come in. It was very, very cool. I don't know if they still do that. I need to look that up.
Megan Gill: That's so cool.
Alia Parise: And so, I was very excited telling them about this. I was like, “They have all these things you could try, sriracha chips and all this other stuff.” And he made some comment to the effect of, “Well, don't overdo it this weekend. I want these samples to fit on Monday.” And I was like, “Excuse me?”
Megan Gill: Yep. Mm-hmm. Wild.
Alia Parise: Even the other texts and the designers looked at him like, “I can't believe he said that.” He wasn't there for that long afterwards. I maybe he had one more fitting with him, and then he was gone.
Megan Gill: Okay, that's good because that's, oof. Yeah.
Alia Parise: They realized that’s not okay.
Megan Gill: Which is great because I feel like there are so many spaces in which those comments are so normalized. I mean, and it's even weirder coming from men. I was on a job recently, and it was a male designer. So not a tech, but still. And he was like saying something about how my bust was a little bit under spec, so I was wearing a thicker bra to hit their spec. And he was like, “Oh, are you wearing the proper undergarment?” And I was , “Yeah. And she was like, “Yeah, she's hitting 37 and a half bust,” whatever. And he said something about how the other designer said that I was fat because my bust was actually on spec, and it was so shocking to my system.
Alia Parise: Wow.
Megan Gill: That's so out of line. You're not funny. That’s not funny. And so, god, I was just like, “Ooh, sheesh.” And what happened to you too, like excuse me? It's that type of shit that's perpetuated – it’s that type of language and that type of phrase continually perpetuates these diet culture narratives. Or I don't know about you, I'm curious to hear your take on as fit models, we are expected to “maintain this size,” right, in order to keep our clients. We're constantly battling – at least I know I am constantly battling that, “Okay, I wanna try to stay the same size so that I'm not losing clients and up and down and all over the place.” And so, I feel like those types of comments could really get to a person and really affect someone. I think it's hard also as the model. How do we shut that down when you need – like, I want that client, but I don't like that language. So how do you kindly say, “Oh, that was inappropriate,” without being like – you know?
Alia Parise: I think I would say it really depends on the client and kind of who's saying it to you. And for me as a plus size model, because there is a lot of variation in plus size, especially with me depending on my measurements. I've had clients call me a 1X, 0X, a 2X, 18, 20, even a 22. My measurement's the exact same, but I've had so much variety in these measurements, and it really is having to have that thicker skin. I understand I'm a big girl, but I've never had the comment of anybody calling me fat, luckily.
Megan Gill: Thank god.
Alia Parise: I know there are some plus-size influencers that are saying, you know, “Fat doesn't mean ugly. Fat is not a bad word.” I'm like I get that, but it's still a hurtful word if people are using it that way.
Megan Gill: Exactly, right. We need to normalize the word in general and not demonize it. And I think our culture has just completely gone that direction with it.
Alia Parise: They’ve absolutely gone nuts with it. There was one particular client, not a full-on horror story, but the client was just very, very toxic. They had brought me in, they always did what they call straight size, you know, like extra small through extra large, maybe some extra large. It was a bit of a higher-end brand, so they were introducing inclusive sizing.
They brought in plus experts from New York and another one that they actually brought out of retirement from Florida. And so, I worked hand in hand with these designers, but the techs were – I'd say a good number of them were very forceful, very blunt, and they would pick at your clothes like this, and they would pick at you, and they would, you know, kind of forcefully turn you while you're working on the garment. And the missy model I was working with at the time, she'd been fitting with them for, like, 18 years, and that was her only client. And so, she would, you know, pull me aside, say, “Oh, I'm sorry about this, I'm sorry about this.” I'm like, “That's not okay.” And she would say, “Oh, does so-and-so pinch you?” I said, “Pinch me?” And she goes, “Yeah, when she grabs the clothes, she pinches me.” I said, “She only pinched me once.” She goes, “Well, what did you do?” I said, “I turned to her, and I just forcefully said, ‘Don't pinch me.’”
Megan Gill: Yeah, we have to advocate for ourselves.
Alia Parise: Absolutely. It's a case of being a fit model, you have to kind of walk that delicate line of being strong for yourself, advocating for yourself, but not offending anybody because everybody in the fashion industry, they're not high strung, but there is a lot of ego there. And so, say for, in inclusive sizing or plus sizing, if something doesn't look good and they’re like, “I like this.” And you have to very carefully say, “I understand you like this design, but for plus you may have to, you know, add a dart here for a bigger body to make it flattering.” So it's hard to work in advocating for yourself and for other people of your size while walking that delicate line of not offending the designer because if they don't like you, you don't get that job anymore.
Megan Gill: Right. That is so, so true. And then that comes along with you are out here just trying to do your job to the best of your ability by offering these comments, which is what we're hired to do, right? I mean, obviously with certain clients, you kind of like understand how much feedback they're looking for, but at the end of the day, it's like we want these garments to then fit other people of similar size and fit them well. And like you were saying earlier, we want people to actually want to purchase them. That is part of the job. So if you're offering up this feedback that's like, “Hey, actually I think this could make it better,” and they're so opposed to it, it kind of defeats the purpose of them hiring you, right?
Alia Parise: Mm-hmm.
Megan Gill: Yeah.
Alia Parise: Every situation is different. Every client is different. It's like if you build a good rapport with the techs and the designers, they'll take your comments into good consideration.
There was one client I worked with where they had two different designers but all under the same label, so the styles were similar. But one designer wouldn't listen to me at all. She'd say, “Oh, add a half inch here.” And I said, “No, you need to add at least an inch and a half because otherwise it's not gonna fit. This fabric does not stretch.” And she was just kind of like whatever. And at some point you kind of stop giving comments because you know they're not gonna listen. And then the little part of your brain says, “Okay, well I'll let your returns speak for me because I said this. This is how you fix this.”
But in the exact same company, there was another designer that would come in with her tech, and they would constantly ask for feedback. “How much you do this, how much you do this? What about here? What about here?” And they would even ask for design feedback like, “What about having this line here?” I said, “Oh, for a fuller bust it should be up here.” And she would ask for a lot of feedback. And at one point I was so frustrated with this other designer that I kind of pulled the one who listened to me aside and said, “She's not listening to my comments. The garments aren't gonna fit well.” And she kind of said, “She doesn't listen to anybody, so the returns are gonna have to speak for themselves,” like what I was saying.
Megan Gill: Yeah. Yeah. Which is hard.
Alia Parise: Yeah, it's hard because you get the designers and the techs who listen, and you get those who don't. And then you get the really interesting ones who want to do their own thing like, “Oh, that's how it's supposed to look.” And I'm like, “Well, it's not really flattering.” She goes, “Well, that's the style.” And at that point, you kind of have to stop giving feedback because they stopped listening.
Megan Gill: Right. It's like less of a collaborative experience at that point, which is unfortunate for everyone. Not only for you, for us not being heard as the fit model, who's there to do this job, but then also the company that's maybe not gonna sell these garments because they're not actually gonna fit. Yeah, I know, I feel like it really keeps us on our toes, moving from client to client, and kind of having to get to know new clients and how they work and kind of what's going on there and like how exactly they're looking to work with a model. It's such interesting work.
Alia Parise: Yeah, and it constantly shifts. Especially also if you get one of those high-profile clients that changes management. That same client that wanted to bring me in to do inclusive sizing, they had the good techs. They had a couple that were iffy, but once I kind of put my foot down, they listened to me. So that was good. But then they brought in a new directing manager. She got rid of a bunch of techs. She brought in some new ones who didn't listen, and you know, it's pretty standard to be measured once a month for a client. She wanted to get us measured every two weeks, and then she bumped it up to every single week.
Megan Gill: Oh my gosh.
Alia Parise: Like you said, it really does take a toll on you mentally, especially – she also was an older model. I believe she was in her fifties, which also doesn't help because she knows as being in her fifties, she's getting ready to be phased out.
Megan Gill: Mm, yeah, which also I hate that side of it all. I think it's really amazing when I see an older model. I’m like, “Yes, okay!” That gives me hope. Also, older women using their bodies to fit garments, we also need that in this industry. Like we need such an array of different people and different bodies and ages. Oh, gosh, it's so wild.
I actually have a similar story where there was a switch in design. The full design team left. They brought in another new full design team. And this was a client that had just started bringing me in a lot. They were always consistent. I had been fitting with them for over a year at this point, and they had been bringing me in for all-day fits. I mean, I was really booking out a lot of time for this client, which was awesome. But my point of contact was a tech, and she left as well. A lot of the team left, and the new tech team got really weird about measuring, because I genuinely, truly, genuinely was on spec for them. What they were looking for in a missy model, I was right down the middle. But this was like last summer. It was really hot. Our bodies expand when it's hot. You're changing clothes, and you are lowkey sweating and your body's hot. And they were like, “Your bust is way over, blah, blah, blah.” And one of the new techs pulled me outside and was like, “Hey, your bust is over,” and I was just trying to advocate for myself as much as I could. Like, “Listen, I measure myself a lot. I know I'm on spec for you guys. I am maybe not wearing the right bra today. It could be anything. We could be on our cycle, like our bodies shift, give or take, throughout like our monthly cycles so much, that I think it is really unfortunate that some clients put so much stress.
Alia Parise: Absolutely.
Megan Gill: It's almost like inadvertent stress on us models, generally speaking. It's so hard. And then I do have the clients that are pretty forgiving, and even if I am like an inch under here or an inch over here, we just take that into account when we're fitting, and I'm really grateful for those clients. And I think that I've learned a lot through that experience last summer. It’s like we just need to have a little bit more grace and not be quite as cutthroat because the things that these techs and designers are saying to us and like saying to models and saying to people that are using their bodies for their job, it's very delicate and it could so easily send us into like a very dark mental place, and I think about that all the time.
I have done a lot, a lot, a lot of work on my own body image and just body image in general and kind of pulling myself out of this hole that I was stuck in for so long when I was struggling and going through it. But then I'm like, gosh, if these people are saying these things to me and they're still kind of, you know, hitting that little wounded part of me, I can only imagine how it would feel to be someone who is maybe in the thick of struggling or somebody who is maybe not doing mentally so well as far as their body image goes. It's like we really have to be careful, and I don't know where that shift happens. But I feel like we also do have a hand in it, like you were saying, kind of as far as advocating for ourselves in these ways and like being firm but kind at the same time and kind of just shutting this stuff down.
Alia Parise: And I think the main thing is kind of shutting it down. I've seen videos on Instagram, on reels, you know, models shutting down photographers when they make those comments or telling on these clients that will do things to them. And I think you have to really grow into that confidence. You and I have a little bit of a thicker skin developed from previous experience, me from design school, from constructive criticism. I developed that early, and in that first couple of years of fit modeling, knowing that they want you to be happy in the clothes. And even designers who said, “Oh, this looks awful,” they’ll turn to you and say, “It’s not you. It's the clothes. We want you to look good!” And those designers and those techs will build you up enough that you can deal with the other ones. But it is definitely a self-confidence thing, and it's not just dealing with it in your job, you're also dealing with it in your daily life.
Unfortunately, I do have a friend who's a little bit negative and a little bit judgmental. We'll be at a Starbucks and somebody is walking down the street, and they're a little bit thicker, but they're wearing something tight. And she'll say, “Just because they make it your size doesn't mean you should wear it.” And I said, “Let her wear what she wants to wear.” And I've gone off on her for that.
Megan Gill: I am so glad that you did because, excuse me, what?
Alia Parise: I said, “That's none of your business. Let her wear what she wants to wear!”
Megan Gill: Yeah, one hundred percent.
Alia Parise: I'm like, “It's not your business, I don't care.” And she's like, “Well, I don't care either.” I said, “If you didn't care, you wouldn't have made that comment.” It's like it’s not your business. She can wear what she wants to wear.
Megan Gill: Right, oh, I think that's such an important piece of it.
Alia Parise: Yeah.
Megan Gill: That it preps you to like shut it down in your personal life as well. Because I can relate with that. I have friends that say something and they're like, “Oh, you're the body image girl! You probably hate that.” And I'm like, “Yeah, there's a different way. Let's talk about it!” It’s maybe not like our emotional labor to kind of teach other people, but to a degree, I don't mind taking that on because I think that, like you were saying, at this point, I have enough self-confidence, and I've developed like a little bit more discernment as far as like how to handle this stuff.
Alia Parise: Exactly. And almost when you become a fit model, you almost become an advocate for your size because it's not just for you, it's for other people. There's one client that I fit for, and they use multiple plus models. And our measurements may be the same, but our body shapes are different. The client I was at this morning, they use one model for a couple of teams. They use me for another couple of teams. For example, her bust is a little bit smaller than me, so they call me in to do the brass for a true 40DD, and then they'll try on other stuff and they say, “Oh, well this is a little bit tight here and this is a little bit big here.” And then you tell them, “Oh, you need to find the happy medium because the other model is, you know, bigger than me here, but my under bust is smaller, or my hip is not as – it's a little flat there. It's not as round.” And so you understand not necessarily the flaws of your body, but how your body is shaped and how it compares to different people. I know, for example, my arms are always one inch long no matter what client I fit with.
Megan Gill: Mine too!
Alia Parise: So no matter what I fit with, that sweater is always gonna look like it hits here. My arms are just long, and depending on the trends, long sleeves are in, so yay for me.
Megan Gill: I know. I know!
Alia Parise: But if they want shorter sleeves, I'm like, “Yeah, that's gonna be like this on me.” So it's understanding your measurements and how it relates to the public, so you almost become an advocate for other people of your size, and knowing how those comments affect you, that's where you can shut other people down, whether it's a tech, a designer or a friend. And you become a person who can speak for others. And that's really, really gratifying.
That swimwear job that I no longer work at, just because they were a little bit toxic and they kind of got worse, but they did swimwear for Walmart, so it was really cool, next season, going into Walmart and seeing these things on the rack and you feel a little bit of pride like, “I helped make that,” especially when somebody picks it up and says, “Oh, this is cute!” And you're like, “Yeah, I helped with that!” And it's a really good confidence booster because just in your own body, it's like, “I used my body to help this look good and help somebody else feel good!” So that is a huge confidence booster. I honestly think all fit models should go to the store, see stuff on, and see what other people think. And you're just like, “Ah!”
Megan Gill: Agreed. I'm getting emotional right now because it's so true. And it's so important. If you really break it down, the work that we're doing is so, so needed, and gosh, hearing you talk about that it’s like you're advocating for other bodies and like other people of your size too, it’s just like, “Ah!” Yeah, that really is what we're doing, and it's really beautiful and lovely, and I also feel a sense of pride when I'm in Target and I'm like, “Oh!” I’ll be with my mom, “I fit that and that and that!” because you know, with explaining what you do – yeah, it is fun. You're like, “This is what I’m doing! I'm making sure these clothes can fit like a real human body of other people that are my size!” It's so, so cool.
Alia Parise: It's fun. And honestly, what I do like about fit modeling is I'm usually not a fan of being in front of the camera. I'll do an occasional print job, but I like being behind the camera. People say, “Oh, you're a model. It must be so glamorous.” Like, no, as a fit model, we are the unglamorous model. We're behind the camera, we're covered in pins, we're covered in marker.
Megan Gill: It’s so true!
Alia Parise: I came home one day, it was hysterical, and they tried on three or four different swimwear tops and swimwear bottoms. And so, you know, they're gonna take a Crayola marker, mark where that one is, then throw on the next one to another Crayola marker, and then you come home covered in marker. And so, there was one spot I couldn't reach, and to my sister I was like, “Amira, can you help me get this?” And she was like –
Megan Gill: You like, “Oh, it’s part of the job!”
Alia Parise: It's part of the job, and then she turns to me and she goes, “I could not do your job. I could not have somebody in my personal space like that.”
Megan Gill: Listen, that's fair.
Alia Parise: It really is Fair.
Megan Gill: Yeah, but it's true. It's nice that there's something about the unglamorous side of fit modeling that's so freeing for me. As someone who grew up dancing competitively, I studied musical theater in college, I did it professionally for a while, so I've always grown up looking at myself in the mirror in a very “glamorous light,” I think kind of. With dance and music theater, your hair is up, you're in a costume, you have full makeup on. So it's been really lovely and freeing to just show up to my fit clients with no makeup, my hair up, bare. It truly has helped me feel more in my body and more in love with my natural self, being in front of the mirror and being on display and being in front of the designers and techs and even just like the photos. Some clients take photos and they'll cut your head out, but with some clients, my head's in it on the iPad or whatever, and I'm just like, “Whatever!” It's been a good challenge for me to be like, “Yeah, it doesn't matter because it's not about that. It's not about how I look,” which has been so freeing.
Alia Parise: Yeah, it's very freeing. Like I said, I've just become so comfortable in my body, but the good and bad thing is I can go to a store, I can pick something up, I can look at it on the hanger like, “Okay, I know that will fit.” It's like I throw something on, I don't even need to try it on. The bad thing is with fitting for clients who have really good quality stuff, it's like you're going through and you and you touch something on the hanger and you're like, “Ew!” It kind of ruins you for shopping off the rack.
Megan Gill: No, it's so true.
Alia Parise: But it's also interesting because you can tell which companies will use a fit model and which won't because, you know, certain things will pinch a certain way, and you can tell, “Okay, this was never thrown on a person. This was thrown on a mannequin.”
Megan Gill: Yep. So true.
Alia Parise: And after just so much experience, you really become a master of your craft to the point where you can even help clients at the pattern-making level. I cannot tell you how many clients, especially when they do pants for plus size, it's like, “Oh, this always looks wrong.” I said, “Let me show you the exact fix that they need to do for plus size. You fix the rise length. And then, you know, then you can get into the terminology. It's like, “Most of the time when they grade the rise for plus, the rise ends up looking like this. You need to change the grade so it looks like this, and that’s how you fix the rise shape.” And they all go, “Oh!”
I've actually worked with a lot of clients who've never done plus size before. And so, you get enough experience, you can help make those changes, and you've helped experienced designers, you've helped experience techs, and you know that they're gonna make a good product. And again, going back to that sense of pride thing, you know, you've done a good job, and it's really wonderful. So it's very, very satisfying.
Megan Gill: Oh, it's so rewarding. And even just that, the fact that you can step in to a client who maybe hasn't worked with a plus model before and be like, “This is how you shift the rise,” that is so incredible and so needed. And the impact you've then had on these people, this company, the clothes they're going to put out into the world, it has so many ripple effects. Yeah, I love that.
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Alia Parise: I was fitting with this client that did bridesmaids dresses. They had another model who is a little bit bigger than me here, and then they had to change a lot of the fits to fit me and accommodate me, and I had a little bit bigger hips than she did. So I fit with them for a little less than a year. And then of course, got the call, “We're going in a different direction.” But internally you don't take it too hard because you know that this is not going to do well for the client because they've had to make so many changes that they're kind of shooting themselves in the foot. So you don't really take it as personally, and it's kind of like, “Okay, whatever, onto the next client.” And so, that’s, like you said, tying back to the anxiety of staying within a certain measurement, but then you've got clients that turn around and change their measurements, so you can't win.
Megan Gill: Oh gosh, I know! I feel like I've been fitting for Target for over two years now, which is awesome. But yeah, I feel like things are always changing, but I do think that, for me, the big mental shift that has really helped me when losing a client or when a client doesn't call me back in or whatever, is I just remind myself there's gonna be another client. Something else is gonna come around.
When I first started doing it, it was very sparse, very few and far between. The pandemic hit nothing for a while with the pandemic. And then 2022 I think is really when it started to take off for me. So three years ago. And now fitting consistently for three years, I understand the ebb and the flow of it all. I agree with you, I love this work, and I'm so grateful to get to do it, and I truly, truly enjoy it. This brings me so much more joy and purpose. And I just really, truly love going to my clients. I don't know that I've ever really felt that before with a job, I guess, that wasn't my creative pursuit. So I love that you feel that too. It's fun to talk about it with someone else who also really, really enjoys it.
Alia Parise: Absolutely. I agree. Like I said, I wanna do this job as long as I can.
Megan Gill: Yeah, me too.
Alia Parise: And I say that because I've got bad knees, so you’ve just gotta be careful what shoes you wear.
Megan Gill: Yeah. No, it is so, so true. Oh my goodness. And it is nice that at least with this work, we are on our feet and maybe not moving quite as much as when I used to serve. It was funny, when I started doing longer fittings and how much my body hurt and how much my feet hurt and my lower back, versus when I was serving a year ago. You're just walking so much that you don't really notice it quite as much. I was never really sore or in pain. Whereas with fitting sometimes, it's like, “Whoa, okay, my body –,” because you're just kind of standing there and changing clothes, and that takes a lot of energy, but I'm grateful that it at least allows me to be on my feet and move my body a little bit and that I'm not always stuck at a desk, kind of like you were saying too. At least we get to be out and about and driving from this client to this client and there's some movement involved, which is lovely.
Alia Parise: Yeah, it's the variety. You get to stand, you get to sit, you get to move around. It's fun going to the clients that do athleticwear and they're you know, “Do squats. Do a couple of jumping jacks. Do a few exercises to see how the clothes react.” And you're like, “Okay!” It’s not good when you did leg day the day before, but yes.
Megan Gill: So true! I also love fitting athleticwear because you're like, “Oh my gosh, yes. This is so important! Let's make sure they're not see-through. Let's make sure I can move in them and the leggings aren't rolling down on me.” All of the things that you would want for yourself, you get to put into these garments that are going to then go be sold to so many people, which is so cool and so incredible.
I don't know if you've felt this way, I'm curious. I think that fitting has helped me love my body. My relationship with my body, it’s really strengthened it because we are using our own unique bodies that are shaped in these unique ways to fit these clothes. We're using our own body as the tool and oh, gosh, going back to it being rewarding, that feels so rewarding. And it also just reminds me that my body is good, my body is needed, my body is doing this job that is so influential for all the people that are gonna go buy these clothes.
Alia Parise: Exactly. It really is. You just become grateful for your body. It's like every time I look in the mirror, there are a few personal things that I would like to see. You know, we're not symmetrical. I've got one boob that's bigger than the other. That's me.
Megan Gill: Oh, same. Yep. Me too.
Alia Parise: A little curve here that's not on this side. I wish I was a little more symmetrical, but every time I look in the mirror, I'm extremely happy with what I see. I think I look great. I've got a nice shape. This looks good on me. This looks good on me. And I never had that feeling of – right? Like I said, there are a couple things I personally would like to change, but it's just for me, it's not for anybody.
Megan Gill: Yeah, me too.
Alia Parise: And I'm always so happy when I look in the mirror. I'm very grateful. I'm happy for the skin that I'm in. I don't wanna gain weight. I don't wanna lose weight. Everybody out there saying, “Oh, do this to get this body,” or “Do this to lose five pounds.” It is none of your business.
Megan Gill: Mm-hmm. Amen.
Alia Parise: I'm so happy in my own body, and once you become so happy in your own skin, your own body, your own shape, you can get better at ignoring those other voices, mass media, the random person, you know, the hater on Instagram who's got no life, you know? You get better about ignoring those voices, and you just become so strong and so happy in your own shape. For example, I always think I look great in the mirror, and then I turn around and see myself in a camera, and I’m like, “Hmm, I'm actually bigger than I thought I was.” But it doesn't bother me. You know, the camera adds ten pounds. It doesn't distribute it. It's not fair.
Megan Gill: It is also so disorienting. I've struggled with a lot of body dysmorphia in my history, and it's like all of these different ways we see ourselves are all so different. And a lot of it I feel like, for me, has been in my head. So it's almost pulling myself out and being like, “Whoa, okay. Why do I think that my body is taking up this much space, when in reality, A, it doesn't really matter because if I feel good in my body, who cares how much space it's taking up, and B, I really need to get out of my own way because it's doing me such a disservice to like the times that I do like look and see, like, “Ugh, I don't like that,” or “I'm bigger than I thought I was on camera,” or whatever it is. It's been so, so important for me to challenge those thoughts every single time they come up, or just like feeling different about them kind of like you were saying like ,”Eh, okay, whatever. So I don't love the way I look in this photo. Okay. All right. Whatever,” you know, instead of taking it in and like taking it to heart.
Oh, I'm just so glad that you shared that. I was just like, “Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes!” as you were talking, yeah.
Alia Parise: It's like we all have bad days. I had one last week, and I was like, “Oh, I'm really big. I'm really bloated,” and then my brain was like, “Yo, you were in a car accident. You're a little swollen. You're fine,” or it's like, you know, you're on your period, or whatever. It's like, "Remember that you had Mexican last night. You're gonna be a little swollen.” It’s like you have to train your brain to stop the negative thought and reframe it. And that does take a lot of work. I'm still doing it myself.
Megan Gill: Yeah. Every day.
Alia Parise: Yeah, right now I'm going through a lot of kind of a self-development journey myself right now. It's like my body confidence is pretty strong. Right now, I'm working on the mental game. It's stopping those negative thoughts so I don't spiral or have a bad day. That’s a big thing.
Megan Gill: Oh my god. Yes, yes, yes. It totally is. I can absolutely relate with you on that. I'm very much on a similar journey, and it's so interesting to be so aware and it's the thing, once you see it, you can't unsee it. So once those thoughts start popping up, and you're so aware of the thought that you're like, “Hey, but wait, brain!” It's so cool to have that experience. Yeah, it sucks, obviously, that these negative thoughts come up, but the reality is they are gonna come up, and if we can just work on our relationship to those thoughts and work on the tools in our toolbox to navigate them and to not take them so literally, or take them to heart and be able to work through them. What empowering work. It's so transformative. I feel like it can change everything for us, which is really cool.
Alia Parise: Absolutely, I agree, and I really think what would help the industry is if the agents who are sending these models out there really take the time to work with these models and say, “Be aware. This is how a casting works. This is how a fitting works.” I really think that they should prepare some of these girls and guys too. It's like you are going to experience one of three situations, one of four situations, and take the time to work with your models. Don't just say, “Show up at this address. Ask for this person.” I've worked with many fit models on, tandem fittings, you know, plus and size small/missy side-by-side. And a lot of times this model I've worked with, it's either her first fitting, her second fitting, and she doesn't even know how to fill out the paper.
Megan Gill: Oh, wow. Yeah.
Alia Parise: And they're just standing there, and I can see them visibly reacting to comments that they say about the clothes. And then when I come up, I make sure she's looking at me and I give different feedback and stand a certain way. And then I'll kind of pull her aside saying, okay, this is how you wanna say this. This is how you wanna do that. And I really think agents don't prepare their models for that. It's kind of scary. When I signed on with an agency a few years back, they were saying, oh, please read through and acknowledge all of this paperwork and documents. And there was a warning in there about being aware of the signs of bulimia and anorexia.
Megan Gill: Wow. Wow.
Alia Parise: Yeah, it’s terrifying. So they’ll give you this paperwork, but talk to your models. Have them be aware of this because it's really mental. The fashion industry is very harsh on your mental game and your mental awareness of yourself and how you're with these people. So I really think agencies should prepare their models more and being fellow models, make friends with your fellow models. They are not competition at all. Those are your truest friends. They will look out for you and you all will be together because we are a sisterhood, brotherhood. Your fellow models will look out for you. Yeah, you've got the ones who are kind of up in their ego and then they see you as competition, but you mentally know that they're not gonna last long, but it's being there for each other.
I did a fitting one time where I was a 2X, and they did a size-run fitting. So they had extra small, small, medium, all the way up to 3X or 4X. All of these models were print models. None of them knew anything about fitting.
Megan Gill: Wow.
Alia Parise: They were all asking each other, and I said, “You guys have never done a fitting?” And they all said, “No.” I said, “Okay, gather around my peoples!”
Megan Gill: Yeah, “I got you!”
Alia Parise: They pulled out their phones. “What's your Instagram?” So that feels really good helping your fellow models, helping other people in this situation.
Megan Gill: Oh, my gosh, I fully agree with you. And for me, oh my gosh, I was not fully prepared. My agents did a decent job of prepping me, but I feel like so much of it also is you get the experience by being on the job, right? You don't really know how it's gonna go down until you're doing it, until you're in the fitting and experiencing it for yourself or when you're experiencing that size run. Or for one of my first tandem fittings I was just listening, taking note, and taking in so much information from the other models I was working alongside. And I think that's another piece of it too. I really cared about this work from day one, and I was really excited about it, so I wanted to learn and understand how to give amazing feedback and how to approach each job. And now, I absolutely agree with everything you're saying. I want to give back to other models in the ways that models before me gave to me and helped me and lent me a hand when I needed it, you know? Or when you have a question.
I came to you with a question recently, and you were so awesome, and I just so appreciate that because I agree. It's like we are all holding hands in this together. If I'm out of casting and there are other models, like I'm gonna chit chat with them, I'm gonna try to become friends with them. “I want you to book this as much as I wanna book this. We're all in this together,” you know? Which feels really cool. It's such a lovely place to be in. Yeah, it's really special.
Alia Parise: Yeah, and that's my biggest thing the last couple years is definitely giving back. I did a couple of interviews with Plus Model Magazine, and they actually published them in the magazine, which I thought was really cool.
Megan Gill: That's amazing.
Alia Parise: And then I had another model saying, “Oh, well they're not that big of a magazine.” I'm like, “They reach enough people. I don't care!”
Megan Gill: Yeah. Who cares? Oh my gosh!
Alia Parise: And I eventually actually pulled all these articles that I did together and actually put together a book.
Megan Gill: I was gonna ask you about this because I went on a deep dive. I saw it on your Instagram, and I was planning on bringing it up here because I think that that's an incredible way to give back and no one has done that before, and so, I'm so excited that you did that. Yeah, sorry. Continue. I'm just excited!
Alia Parise: Yeah. And so, it started off with a couple articles, like what's in your fitting bag? One of the big things was doing a virtual fitting. I know you said you didn't have work during the pandemic, but I did. I had a couple of clients that really could not stop fitting. And so, what they ended up doing was sending samples to me at my house. I had a cleaner backdrop. And then I would have a setup just like this. I would fit the clothes virtually and then send them back to them. Lysol is your friend.
And so, I was explaining my setup, the tablet, working with your agent, and I think I did one other article. I don't remember off the top of my head. But I basically took those three articles and combined it and put them together in the book. It's literally called Fit Model 101: An Introductory Guide to Working in the Fashion Industry. It's not necessarily a how-to book. It's really just to get you started. What is a fitting versus what is a casting, looking for the right agency. I don't name any names. I just say, “I would recommend looking at an agency that has a department that does fitting because then they know what jobs to book you for.” The first thing on there is don't quit your day job because you don't get jobs instantly. You don't.
Megan Gill: Right, right, right. Yeah, so important, such important stuff.
Alia Parise: Exactly. And there's a whole chapter in there that I specifically wanted to expand on talking about your mental awareness. When people say, “This doesn't look good, they're not talking about you. They want you happy in the clothes.” And there's a small section in the back that’s, “When they say bust, it's this measurement. When they say over bust, it's this measurement,” and little sections in the back with little bits of terminology. You know, every client is different. Some call PP some call pre-production, QC, and I say in the book, they do not expect you to learn these terms right away. They really don't. And because then you'll get into more technical stuff. With bras, there's a lot of different technical stuff: wires, gores, lining, different fabric. Swimwear is extremely technical. There's elastic, there's rubber, there's layers, there's mesh. It's a lot. So I don't put all that in the book. It's just literally a beginner's guide. “This is how you get started. If you need a quick reference guide, here's what PP means. Here's what first fit means, and general comments about giving feedback.” If someone asks, “Oh, how do you like that top?” saying, “I don't like it,” is not helpful. You may not know the term, but saying, “Oh, it's too big here. It's too tight here.” That is helpful feedback. Saying you don't like it is not helpful.
Megan Gill: Right, right, right. Yep. Oh my gosh. I'm so glad you wrote this, and I'm so glad that it's out there, and it’s so important. All the agencies should be like handing one of these to their new fit models like, “Here we go to get you started!”
Alia Parise: Honestly, I've kind of put it off. I haven't done a print run of it yet. It's only digital. It's available on my website. It's not on Amazon yet. I need to work with a publisher and some print copies and send them out to the agents because they have the link where they can get it on my site and then they'll get an agency discount. It's like 10% or 15% depending on who I sent the link to. But yeah, I don't make a lot of money off of it, but I get the satisfaction of giving back to these models. In fact, when I get a purchase through my website of the book, I will email the person who purchased it, “Thank you for purchasing. Please let me know if you have any questions. Once in a while I'll get a question, but most of the time they're like, “Okay, thanks. I'm good!”
Megan Gill: I love that. That's incredible. Truly. It's amazing. Thank you, Alia. Thank you so much for chatting with me. This was so good for my soul, and I'm just really grateful for you for taking your time to talk with me.
Alia Parise: Yes, I'm grateful to be here. I really, really love talking about the subject. You can tell I'm very passionate, especially advocating for plus size. More and more companies are doing it. Not every company is doing it right, so that's my goal. It’s to try to help all the companies do it right. And it's like advocating for more plus size. Everybody wants to be included, and we want to feel cute in our clothes. We should not not have that because we're an 18 or whatever size. And so, this subject is really close to my heart and I'm glad you asked me to be here, and I'm glad to have talked to you today, Megan.
“ I'm so happy in my own body, and once you become so happy in your own skin, your own body, your own shape, you can get better at ignoring those other voices (mass media, the random person, you know, the hater on Instagram who's got no life). You just become so strong and so happy in your own shape. For example, I always think I look great in the mirror, and then I turn around and see myself in a camera. I was like, ‘Hmm, I'm actually bigger than I thought I was.’ But it doesn't bother me because the camera adds 10 pounds. It doesn't distribute it. It's not fair.”
- Alia Parise
For three years, Alia worked as a graphic designer at a lingerie company and accomplished many things and expanded her skill set. From working in the fashion industry, she discovered fit modeling and found that it suited her! She began my fit modeling career eight years ago, and while the work wasn’t immediate, she gained experience slowly but steadily. She’s fit with a variety of clients from swimwear to lingerie to athleisure to luxury lifestyle brands. Every client, individual, and company she’s worked with was a blessing and an excellent learning experience. They were varied in their direction and execution, and it gave her a great opportunity to expand her horizons and accomplish many different projects and goals. Being different is fun; being ordinary is boring. Look at everything for what it can be!
Connect with Alia on her Website
Get Alia’s Book: Fit Model 101: An Introductory Guide to Working in the Fashion Industry
While I’m not a licensed therapist, registered dietician, or medical health professional and cannot speak to body image topics from a clinical, trauma-informed place, I am an expert of lived experience. I’m an academic of my own body, and I’m passionate about facilitating conversations with other humans about their relationships with their bodies. I believe it’s important to continue conversations about healthy body image in creative spaces as a means to heal individuals as well as the collective whole. But just know the information presented in this medium is not professional mental health advice or medical advice, and any questions or concerns you have should always be directed to your health providers.
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